xp ratios

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by icedfate, Jun 16, 2011.

  1. icedfate

    icedfate Member

    I know I've brought this up before but the xp ratios are ridiculously unbalanced.

    you get about 1.6 to 1 ratio on every point spent on energy

    while you get 20 to 60 to 1 ratio on every point spent on stamina (I'm accounting for the fact it costs 2 point to raise stamina by 1 point)

    couple that with the fact all the missions that cost energy are 30 levels apart...you really only need 300 energy points to master everything.

    this makes it a waste to put points in energy
    its a waste to choose characters that speed up energy regeneration speed.

    the game is lopsided to force you to build pvp characters.

    seeing as you can have 2000 clan members....its pointless to try and pump up defense, unless you can manage to actually find 1000 facebook friends that all play this combined with the 10,000 favor points you need to get the other 1000

    so no matter how many points you put in defense you are helpless against players that have more clan than you.

    so the only stats worth putting points into are stamina and attack, and some health

    the same holds true in pirate clan.

    zombie slayer is better balanced
  2. adventures primary benefit is drop items. These items are often superior to random boss drop items and roughly equivalent to boss helper items in the later stages of the game. This is especially true of warrior drops. It would be unbalanced to get mass numbers of the best free warriors in the game and get comparable XP in the process. I think the current XP ratios are fair as they are now:
    PVP battles = max xp, low coin payout, and no drops
    Boss fights = mediocre xp, terribly low coin payout, decent weapon drops and few warriors
    Adventures = negligible xp, decent coin payouts, good weapon and warrior drops

    As far as zombies goes the adventure drops are absolutely useless, they practically all are destructives. Hence why energy build can level easier there. But you also have that god-awful 20 battle minimum cap, which is just plain horrid.
  3. icedfate

    icedfate Member

    I hadn't looked at it that way..so they made the quests give crappy xp to balance the fact that you get really good item drops from quests.

    meanwhile those drops are useless unless you have high pvp stats..so basically they do nothing to encourage players to try out different builds.

    so a high energy build would get tons of items but have no ability to use them effectively.

    so theres really only one viable build in this game and nothing else will work out for you..

    and granted..I'm only level 1020, but so far I'm getting the best drops from bosses not adventures

    and also, your theory may hold true for viking clan but it does not seem that way in pirate clan

    agan, I'm around 1020 in pirates as well but davy jones, cartagena, japan, new orleans so far just about every adventure drops items with the worst stats in the game worse even than the free gifts..most of the items that drop are only useful as prerequisites for the next following adventure as they have stats like 3 attack 5 defense..
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2011
  4. Reorx

    Reorx New Member

    Actually, you need 10 GP for 3 chieftains, and you start the game with one. So, to get 999chieftains you need to get only 3,333 GP.
  5. Das liebe Beil

    Das liebe Beil Well-Known Member

    Actually you need 3330 God Points for chief in Viking Clan. You start with 10 FP, so you need to acquire 3320. Challenges are the most easy way to get them, but they're also frustrating. Then again, they're free FP. Leveling gives you 1 FP per level and some FP for Level up achievements or later character/adventure/boss achievements. I got to 2330 free FP before I decided to buy the last missing Chiefs.

    Getting 1000 clan on FB goes pretty fast. The World Boss feed has potentially 20k watchers, getting some 100 to add you is only a question of time.

    Energy, well you can safely shun it and have only 666 to be able to do adventures several times and get some drops and not waste excess energy upon leveling. Or you go for a high energy build, invest 2k skills there and exploit the daily Energy boosts. The Warriors you drop in Helheim and beyond are quite good for attack or defense. Most of them can be blacksmithed into better warriors. I go for 2k Energy so I can exploit the Daily Rewards and Energy Boosts to the fullest (and getting Energy as fast or faster than stam is pretty funny in my eyes).

    The coin payouts are quite huge, my current best adventure paid me up to a Billion coins.

    So, doing an adventure that pays out 950 Million average for 123 Energy several times a day sums up.

    With a 100% daily reward, an Energy boost and let's say 500 Energy from leveling while having 2000 Max energy, you can do this adventure 36 times. 36 x 950 Million = 34,2 billion. Not bad, and consider that you'll most likely level more than once a day. 3,8B upon every level up for this adventure. And a 55% chance to drop a good warrior.

    Sure the xp for the 123 Energy adventure is only 1 : 5,5. My Stam to xp ratio is around 1:240, 1:120 when looking at invested Skill Points.

    Don't get me started on ZS though. I have over 3000 Energy there and leveled 7 times within some minutes yesterday. Without going for bought refills. And around Level 750 speedleveling is not that easy.
  6. Ahad

    Ahad Member

    I know you told us not to... But i am slightly curious as to how you hold your own on the fightlist with all that energy.

    I have a friend with more energy than you :p

    And he / she considers himself / herself comparitively weak for his / her level

    I myself will not add anymore energy to my 420

    As i fear it will leave me weak compared to my rivals

    Most of whom level obnoxiously slow

    Due to more defence

    Than the surrounding perimeter barrier

    Of Canada's 'back yard'

    In a hard of hearing kind of way

    No, in a hypothetical kind of way

    ...Metaphorical kind of way?

    *NO the friend i refer to is NOT AS you would expect from the way that i laid out this post, that i am mimmicking someone or something but no.. He broke the mould when he developed his posting habits. I merely seperated my points in a staggered sort of way, like that Stevie that i mentioned, did you get that? Eh?
  7. Reorx

    Reorx New Member

    I stand corrected. Still, I have a lot of wok ahead of me.
  8. Ahad

    Ahad Member

    2 Points on this..

    1. Builds - There are a possibly infinite number of different configurations of skill point builds. No single build is the best, It's ALL ABOUT HOW YOU USE WHAT YOU HAVE
    2. Drops - Have you checked to see if any of these item drops with "worst stats in the game" are used in the workshop, for crafting more powerful items?

    I personally thing you could be surprised on a number of things. I will spoil no surprise, it will be more satisfying if you discover / learn them for yourself.
  9. icedfate

    icedfate Member

    *builds - I'm aware that there s an infinite number of possibilities, what I'm saying is that unless you build a certain way you are screwed by the developers.
    *drops- no I had not checked the workshop, but seeing as the recipes are so hard to make its not viable anyway

    example..."hellfire chariot" needed 50 fire chariots, 50 fire wingsuits to make 1. it would take several thousand energy spread out over many days to get that many items. with 400 clan I need 2000 weapons, 1 hellfire chariot is not gonna make a difference,


    Goddess Crafted Armor - - - Attack: 59 - Defense: 64
    Unlocked at Level 1280
    Available in Vingolf
    Cost to Manufacture: $28B
    Items Needed/Where to Get Them
    Ice Shield (x1) - Boss Helper Reward for minimum damage - Vingolf Coop Boss (Skadi)
    Celestial Cloak (x1) - Completing Vingolf Odin's Rune Challenge

    that would take days just to make 1!

    in regards to the level 3320 thing I realized that one too..but seeing as I'm able to level maybe 3 or 4 times a day, I have another half a year before I get there.

    and again, theres no point in building defense or getting defensive items unless I can get my 2000 clan because unless I max out my clan I'm always gonna be at the mercy of people with more clan, they just overwhelm me with greater numbers

    2000 energy - I need 10,000 xp to level up, I get one energy boost a day, I get 141 xp for a 74 energy job (my best adventure) thats 3810 xp on full energy, then another 3810 xp on the energy boost.
    so even with 2000 energy and the energy boost its still not enough to even level once!

    "With a 100% daily reward, an Energy boost and let's say 500 Energy from leveling while having 2000 Max energy, you can do this adventure 36 times. 36 x 950 Million = 34,2 billion. Not bad, and consider that you'll most likely level more than once a day. 3,8B upon every level up for this adventure. And a 55% chance to drop a good warrior."

    considering I get 100 billion income per hour just sitting there..that is bad

    zombie slayer is the only kanoapps game where an energy build works
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2011
  10. Ace

    Ace Member

    Those workshop items you mentioned are hard to make, specially the Hellfire Chariot. I made one for the hell of it.

    And by the way, defense is pretty useful. I have 986 Chieftains, and I see people with up to 1300 lose both ways simply because they're stats are poorer than mine, and because I'm better geared. On early levels clan size's a determining factor, as you move on, you can manage with a smaller clan than your enemies pretty well, and assuming you mentioned Vingolf recipes, your level's higher than mine.

    And yeah, Energy sucks for leveling up, but you'll find out that it'll make you plenty stronger given time. Spending stamina on bosses if you don't like PvP seems to be a wiser choice.
  11. Ahad

    Ahad Member

    I'm only low in PC lol, around 500, I basically assumed everything i said but Ace obviously knows what he's talking about (because he is the ACE)

    I'm not even sure on the build i'm going to end up with yet, in any of the 3 apps excluding Zombie Slayer.

    I just slap 5 down wherever i see fit whenever i level up or earn an achievement (sometimes more than 5 but you know what i mean... less clicks :) )

    I don't really plan all that much, i just DO, go through with, and see how it all turns out.

    Not like i'm really that bothered about the other 3 apps though, they're just for passing the time while waiting on regen in ZS. If i do well, then i do well. If not, well atleast i wasn't sitting watching the ticker timer tick tock tick tock... Just like a watched kettle never rings, a watched telephone never boils, when watching the ticker timer it seems to stop the clock :confused:

    Or maybe it's some sort of lag, my computer isn't the best and my internet could be quicker aswell. Maybe it's down to the streaming of choonj to my Xbox, but i couldn't play in silence. That woulzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
  12. icedfate

    icedfate Member

    the hellfire chariot, I'm high enough to make, the next one I mentioned is way beyond my level too..I only mentioned that one because it requires an item that can only be gotten from that stupid card game and that takes 3 days to finish just once...so making one of those every 3 days is not going to make a difference.

    I mainly do spend my stamina on bosses, also do pvp and put 1500 attack skill, I put enough 500 energy and 20k health to get the achievements and have been working toward the 1500 stamina achievement. I mainly do the bosses not because I hate pvp but 880 stamina is tough to spend when you get only 4 or 5 opponents and then you run out of people to fight..mainly because almost everyone has at least 1200 clan now.

    my battle list right now has 6 opponents, 1100 clan, 1300 clan, 650 clan, I cant beat those guys, then a 350 clan, a 230 clan which are ok and a 115 clan, which gives crap xp.......4 stamina and now nobody left for me to fight
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2011
  13. icedfate

    icedfate Member

    that's another gripe I have..we are forced to build pvp characters but are not given enough opportunities for pvp
  14. build as PvM

    attack/health,stam shoulda been main focus from start

    ya really only need enough energy to get very last adven done 3x per level up

    if this build is done right

    ya can level almost at will

    long as theres bosses to blast
  15. icedfate

    icedfate Member

    thats how I built and thats exactly my point, you have to build a certain way or you are screwed.
    I have enough to blast all the bosses whenever they come up but then I have to wait for them to come back
  16. You would be surprised how much good items can count for in a battle, in PC for example I had to have roughly 4000 more attack points than a rivals defense points to compensate for 500 clan size worth of mateys, ships and the like. That's a huge bonus that those items gave him.

    In Pirates the only good adventure drops from Davy Jones and the earlier areas are the ships. One of the strongest players in the game still has a tyndall-load of Pirate Galleys. The weapon drops are lame but just get the achievement and stock up on ships. Later in the game the matey drops from the Bahamas and beyond really help relieve the high upkeep costs from Sea Dog mateys, and once you hit Bombay then you start seeing some really sweet mateys and ships.

    Weapons on the other hand you can usually amass from bosses.

    There are several builds that are extremely effective if you play them right; Aside from the slow and steady balanced build,

    You can build a PVP tank with high att/def, and mediocre stam and health and if you level with a partner you can still level fast and are nearly invincible in fights, the downside is that you need a partner to level fast for free.

    If you don't care to wait on a partner and have few enemies then you can go nuts with attack, health and stamina and blaze fight lists and bosses with ease. The downside of this is you will attract annoying leeches and will die easier vs same level rivals

    Or you can be one of those annoying tyndall leeches and put nothing on health, and almost everything on attack, stamina and defense. I made a character like this on hi5 and by leeching on to one high health player I could level 4 times before I injured them. As long as there are low defense players you will be able to level endlessly. The downside is this build annoys the crap out of a lot of players and you will get hitlisted alot.

    It's all in the style you prefer to operate in, there's no "perfect" build, its just a matter of preference

    With PVP fighting beyond a certain level you will need to have either a few tenacious rivals that will keep healing or a level partner just due to the fact that the player stock is built like a pyramid not a tower.

    Also the Hellfire Chariot was an act of throwing a bone to the senior players who had amassed thousands of wingsuits and chariots. What you really want to focus on with blacksmithing in my opinion are mistrunners, under giants, cavern kings, underworld longships, and poison strokes. Mistrunners and cavern kings are among the few that can be mass produced as well.
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2011
  17. two friends were trying to level with eachother. both around level 350, but 1 has 175 clan the other has 250 the one with low clan has 200 attack and 200 defense, while the one with more clan has 350 attack and 1 defense. Guess what.those few clan members worth of those so called useless drops, makes 1 defense more than enough to win DEFENSIVELY against somebody with 200 times their defense strength.

    Underworld Dragon Boat. 50/50 biggest downside, is it takes a legendary item to craft. underworld longship is a 47/47 item. I can buy the legendary knife, and pay for the crafting once every hour, and still have change left over for other crafts.

    Steel Sword, only thing consumed there is the alfheim dagger set.

    there are plenty of poweful items you can craft, very easily, that use items you'll NEED in your inventory anyway. Items that you would likely WANT to hoard up on.

    FYI I'm lvl 1830, with 1973 clan. There's a level 2400 with 2k clan who's rather upset about losing to me when attacking or defending. they have higher defense than my attack, and I assume the same is true for their attack vs my defense. But when attacking I've noticed, they don't have any blacksmith items in their inventory.

    Then recruit. complaining that it's just too hard is just a cop out. Start sending the canned add me message to those you beat down it worked wonders for me.

    Additionally, 3320 is Favor Points needed to get 1000 hired chieftans. IF you DON'T lose any hands, you can complete the Aegir's Passage rune challenge every 4 hours. I complete it 2 or 3 times a day.
    Zombie Slayer is also the only Kano App where the workshop and the drops are completely pointless. Since you only use your 20 top squad tops. most just buy the UN items, to fight with.
  18. Ahad

    Ahad Member

    Zombie slayer is the only Kano App where it is actually possible to max out your fighting items with Limited Special items, without spending a boatload of real money on reward points whatever they may be called in the game you first think of.
    Doing this in any of the other apps would most likely lead to a ban for not giving other (normal) players a fighting chance.

    I love that about this, it still takes a fair bit of time to get there but it is definitely possible, and just having a fair few UN items alongside the challenge rewards / crafted items (if you have the money to waste) can lead to being rather powerful when fighting people.

    I managed to beat someone with higher top squad defence by, as i like to think, having more or better UN items :D
  19. It would take 750,000 god points to max out on god items in VC and 1,080,000 god points to max out on god items in PC.....Spending $100 a pop give or take that's $192860!!!!!!! Only ONE player (who is primarily PC only) has that much money to throw away on this game. The rest of us would much rather take that money and buy a house (in most parts of the country that is, maybe a down payment in more expensive areas) Though I have a feeling aforementioned player has spent enough on this game to literally own all the property in the Detroit metro area.
  20. Das liebe Beil

    Das liebe Beil Well-Known Member

    750k Gods on Viking Clan.
    560 Gods for 75 € (give or take, depends on exchange ratio, gone are the days of 1€ to 1,60$)
    1340 * 560 is roughly 750.000
    1340 * 75 € = 100.500 € Not exactly a house here in Germany, but a good start to financing one.

    And that's only the God Items. Now you need 996 bought Chiefs, you start with 10 FP for free. Another 450 € for 3360 FP's. But after buying a complete loadout of FP Weapons and Warriors that is peanuts.

    And if you have this much money, then you almost can't lose. You don't need monsters to level off, you can focus on a low-health PvP build. And no one will be able to fend you off or win against you.

    And my conviction still stands, 2000 Energy is a good idea. I got over 1000 Mateys as an adventure drop from Bombay. I have hundreds of Warriors as adventure drop from Midgard GT on Viking Clan. A hybrid build of PvM with high Energy would be an interesting sight for sure.

    For a fact, this is my goal for my hi5 pirate. High Energy, High Stam/Health/Att, very low defense.

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