Improving competition and stability in Faction seasons

you guys are getting off topic, your wasting your breath talking about alt accounts that im not sure kano is all that interested in getting rid of, thier game is worth more with more accounts active plain and simple.

what the focus of this thread is "to improve competition" i dont care who has an alt account, i dont care what faction has 20 alt accounts, if you make a competition that is based on PLAYING stats, you can have all the alt accounts you want, they wont win.....plain and simple.

every minutes someone spends on their alt account is a minute they are losing to me playing on mine, ill take them all day....ill take them every day, ill take them every week.....give us a real competition and you guys wont have to worry about an alt account or alt faction winning.....

and then you can whine in another thread about how more accounts is ruining a game where you need opponents.....

 

Thanks all for the feedback and discussion. The main goal in all of this is to:
-reward active play throughout the entire season,
-increase competition
-remove the who finished first Sunday midnight(PDT) Gamer Point rush, which caused a negative impact on account security
-remove the ability to game the system with multiple alternate accounts

The following is the proposed revised scoring structure. Players contribute to their Faction GP total using the following categories up until their maximum is met.


Categories:


Boss Category (Daily Max - 5000):
boss attack 100 GPs
boss power attack 500 GPs


Outbreak Category (Daily Max 5000):
outbreak performed (835-1700 GPs dependant on location and must be on an outbreak where the achievement hasn’t been reached or a last location outbreak)


Fight Category (Daily Max - 5000):
fight attack win 300 GPs
*fight attack loss removed


Help Category (Daily Max - 1000):
100 GPs for each action *previously 200
boss help
fight help
outbreak help
challenge help
gift accept
contract join


Level Category (Daily Max Uncapped):
Additional points can be contributed to a Faction through levelling. Must be greater then level 150 to contribute. Lower level level-ups will give a lower GP reward compared to higher level level-ups (You can level up more frequently at the lower levels)

 

Fight loss remove:On the surface it seems great.
But just what happens when someone literally can't beat anyone in range?
That will cause them to punch downwards to provoke a fight from a lower level.
Removing completely for a loss probably isn't the best idea.
Maybe lower it from 150 to like 50 or even 25.
Just saying...

Far as the level category,can't disagree 1 bit with that one.
Excellent.

 

What is this? Thats not enough change in the LEAST!!!!!

Its the SAME amount of stamina in a boss....

The SAME amount of fight wins to complete...

Twice as many help points... Oh my word... they actually have to put 10 1 stamina attacks into a boss help now?

The SAME amount of outbreaks....

At the bottom of this... A cheating faction can still outrank a legit one. A cheat just cant be number one.

Im not impressed. BOOOO!!!!! hisssssssssssssssssssssss.....

Divide all the points given for each action by 10. that I would accept as a fair faction competition.

The devs need to understand my arguement. When you create the need for a spot in the faction to be filled with an account,to compete in the ranks, You create the oportunity to fill that spot with an alternate account to gain the rank.

If the points are not uncapped. Alternate accounts will always be a factor in the ranks. If you must condone that so be it! The very least you can do is make it hard for a cheater to reach the limit by increasing the amount of all actions required by 10 fold.

I understand Not everyone wants to sit down and play for about an hour or so that it may take to reach those limits, There is already "daily rewards" for people who just want to log in and do a few minimum things everyday... Nobody should think they are a world leader for that sort of game behavior. You arent. Youre doing the minimums.

 

That's what I call a cheap sticking plaster!

I can see bosses going under ground.
Outbreak help will be sorted before posting.
Energy Accounts will still have a big advantage.
Guys will attack own Faction for 900+ fights each a day.
All help will go inhouse before posting.

And this is called a solution to the problem?

What about losing points for being pk'd, listed or losing a fight? Where is this Top Faction getting it's status from, because they don't have to leave their own back yard to be the best?

If ever there was a way to make Factions meaningless, this is it!!

 

See where your negativity comes in? I swear you need a hug Alka.

Its not 5000 fights a day, its 5000 gamer points at 300 points a win. You can translate down the board and see, they changed nothing at all!

Only changes made where to not counting losses (which was your suggestion)

doubling the help count (which is useless)

and adding for extra points for how many times you leveled up. Its weak sauce.

 

so let me see if i get this right....in order to do daily gps we need to do the following....
attack a boss - 10 power attacks (300 stam)
do 3-6 outbreaks depending on level (400 nrg)
win 17 fights (17 stamina)
do ten helps (no cost to slayer)

and those minimum actions will determine seasonal champion?
kano your missing the boat here.....again these numbers are nothing to an alt account, nothing......
i would still be surprised if it took more than five minutes to gain these actions.
my counter proposal would be this.....
boss attacks 100 gps for 1 stam, 500 for power attack - no maximum for the day
outbreaks 870-1700 depending on outbreak, must be in last outbreak or an undone, no max for day
fights 300 gps for fight win, 25 gps for fight loss, no maximum for the day
helps 25 gps per help....no maximum for the day

and then tell me a faction with 23 alts can compete with real players.....using numbers like this, they cant, they wont, end of story
real factions will win....each time, every time, every week
want to go a bit further....give 25 gps for each attack on hit list
give 25 gps for each boss help (alts are notoriously low on boss helps - easiest way to spot them really)
give 25 gps for challenge helps (again alts are notoriously low on any helps besides gifting)
give 50 gps for outbreak assists (you only allow 30 of them and the best players dont always get 30 every day)
give 10 pts for each punch thrown
give 25 pts for each punch kill
give 50 pts for achieving 16,000 of your gps old style (this contest shouldnt have any relation to old gps)
give 50 pts for a boss kill
give 50 pts for collecting a bounty
give 20 pts for listing a bounty
give 25 pts for a counterattack
give 50 pts for a booby trap

make those your playing stats and alt factions will disappear because they will not put in the time and energy/stamina to compete with someone who plays, and i dont want to hear that anyone is being forced to play, if you dont play you wont win, its that simple, dont make a contest for people who arent playing, we want to determine the top faction for an entire week, lets have a top faction contest where people have to play.

Thats what i want, i think thats what others want, anyone that wants anything different is counting on alts to win......
pretty simple, pretty straightforward....

thats my opinion i welcome yours
slave

 

i cant believe i forgot my top one...
1000 gps for each world boss power attack...want to see who is playing and who is an alt....
look at the number of world boss hits.....

afraid to find out whos playing and whos not its easy enough to tell

 

and on top of all that we need a definitive tie breaker, that shouldnt be based on time....

 

Thanks for your comments, note that we are working with the current structure because there just isn't the resource to overhaul the Faction season system.

People gaming the system will still compete even if the actions are increased it would be a game of catch up. What really ends up happening is genuine active player's game experience degrades to a more daily grind "job" feeling. If anything, GP actions should be reduced giving more weight to leveling up over the course of the season. Alt accounts having to compete with active players full time throughout the week in levels for all suspected accounts, that would be much harder to do.

 

Hi Slave, the information to all of your recent responses is contained in this thread.

 

If you LACK the recources... Then just take your time with it! Seriously It has gone on so long already... Whats the rush?

Do as HeyUwtf requested, Take out the XP, because its not a legit way of rating. and then work on something worth while.

If memory serves. We as players went well over 6 months without a new challenge... And when the devs finnally got tired of people complaining, They just cranked out some new rocket shooters, instead of giving us the kind of challenge that we where begging for.

I also have to point out... there was a long period of time with no new countries... (I believe it was after japan) We as players, can be paitent for something that is worth the wait. Dont ruin the fact that we have waited so long already, just for as soon as its put on the discussion board, throw a bandaid on it and call it good. The devs could have made a fix like this Months ago.

Really I suggest this thread be put in the news section... Express to the gamers how important it is, You'll probably see Dozens of new people join the community, and Inactive memebers dusting off thier forum accounts to chip in thier 2 cents. I run over this thread by a meere chance. How many people that have an opinion, have not been heard?

I have to be honest with you, If this is the best solution, Your willing to come up with. I truly feel let down.


In reply to people feeling like they are "grinding" on gamerpoints. That would only be true for people that are doing thier GP to cheat thier way to the top ranks. Its what you are trying to get rid of.


Gamer points come naturally... You help people because it helps you level... You do outbreaks because it advances you into skill points, achievments and well you get the energy as soon as you level up.

You attack bosses because its impossible to do your full level up on fight list alone. thats where your stamina goes when your ready for a level up.

Even high levels could accumiulate a great amount of fight just by attacking hitlist, and retaliating to rivals attacking them on the hitlist.

Somone that plays the game, just because they enjoy it. Doesnt feel like its a job to get gamerpoints, because they come automatically. Its not something they are "trying" to do.

I also have to tell you that the level up score could only make the alt factor worse. When I first decided to rebuild, transfer myself from myspace to facebook... I went with stamina and energy first mainly because I knew i was going to need it later, and i wanted to level up fast. I was able to crank out 40 levels in just an hour or two of play and well into level the level 800s before it started to slow down.

I can also tell you, That gives me a reason to target a small players in enemy factions and make sure to set them negative. I have been set negative before in a bad way, and taken well over 24 hours to make it out of that level, and i dont mean because i wasnt playing either. I had to hit every help that i could find, refill stamina, HOG up the whole fight list... it was hella work to get out of that level... and that one level will actually pay less than the next level, which will come much easier.

10 fold would not be over the top...

500 stamina on a boss. 170 wins worth of fights... 40 completed mission clicks... and 50 helps...

That would account for an hours of play... hint: nobody wants to play 10 alts for an hour each. Nobody wants to have to play somone else's account for an hour that they could be working on thier own...

but ANYONE... Can find enjoyment out of playing thier own account, for 1 hour.


I must admit. the outbreaks sounds a little high. at least 20 outbreak actions would be fair. you may have to level up 2 times to complete that... what ever will people do??? oh yeah. stop cheating

This is not going to be fixed with a banaid. I mean, you can if you like, slap a bandaid over a gunshot wond. but your patient is still bleeding to death doc.

 

no skywalker, i believe the reluctance on kanos part is deeper than the surface view. i dont believe for a second that playing this game is a grind, eric, if you guys had someone on staff that played every day they would tell you how far off base this is.
so using a "grind" as an excuse to not making a true faction challenge, means you really dont want a faction challenge, and the only reason that kano doesnt want a faction challenge is it will expose things that kano does not want exposed....
what too many alts? more alts than players? will it expose how few people are really playing the game?
its one or a combination of those....
what else would prevent a gaming company from giving gamers what they want? all we want is a real faction contest, i dont think it s asking too much to get one....

but hey the messaging portion was left out of the last one...blasphemy
how could we play without messaging being a key portion of our games, talk about a grind.....

come on eric give us a little more than what youve given us, ive seen a lot of good ideas posted here and you have been reluctant to accept any of them

i dont get it
slave

 

I love how reducing actions would actually increase the weight of leveling up, when the weight of leveling up has not been put in place yet at all. If you wanted the leveling up to be heavier. then you make it heavier in the first place!

I also cant help but noticed that the description of how many points are contributed by leveling up is so verry vauge. I do not have the confidence that there is even an existing balance for how much each level up should be worth... as i stated before, somone who does not care about thier crappy alt can make it full on energy and level it up a hell of a lot more than a legit player trying to build strong on the same account they have been playing for years. There simply would be no fair balance in existence.

I truthfully dont care who has how many alts. I just want it subtracted from the faction ranking. Is that too much to ask?

Please Credit the people who are playing the game by the TOU. and stop Chopping them down and making them look lesser than a cheat.

What i get from all this. Kano is just fine with cheaters... in fact they endorse them. Ranking them the top groups in the world.

You may as well have just said it straight forward.


Im sorry that I am not a moron, and i will not be BS'd on this subject. I first adressed it in march. I put a thread up about it. Was rated 33 times I am streched to find ANY idea that has recieved more ratings. a 7.9 rating. You may say you only impliment ratings of 9 and higher, but this is somehting will decrease somones ability to cheat, You have to consider that it is going to get a lot of 1 ratings from people who LIKE TO CHEAT.

a 7.9 is an OUTSTANDING rating for an idea of that nature. You cannot deny that.

 

and in case you havent noticed .....and im guessing you havent eric by the comment about leveling. There is a substantial amount of slayers who are not interested in the slightest to level up. Do you know why? What does your resident xpert on game play suggest as to why people dont want to level up? (cricket....)

they dont want to level up eric because there is no fight list if they do, and people like to fight, they really like to fight, and they are trying to not level up because then they will move out of the range of a nice fat fight list, like i have.....

i have a total of 12 possible people to fight, that includes slayers above my fight range....they want full fight lists all the time so they can compete with other slayers for top spots.

leveling in a fighters mind is not worth the price of beans in china....

thats the sad sorry truth, the only ones that want to level are the people that want to brag, or the nergy players, (i have a slightly differnt need), but the end result is the same...

 

ROFLMAO,....."One of these reasons is the recent appearance of fake factions (which Wonder Bread and Aardvark are working hard to remove.) We are also seeing quite a lot of account sharing because of the need to finish gamer points first".


Recent??? this has been going on from day one of guilds/ factions and players have been complaining to support and here in the forums about it from the onset. Saying that it is a "recent" thing is a slap in the players face....so much for Kano listening...eh?

 

Please don't drop the GP gain for fight losses. Fight losses still represent active players, and I for one get more fight wins. You drop the GPs one gains for being active win or lose, and you drop the number of free fight wins I get.

From what I understand, you're trying to weed out the alt factions that consistently score high on the faction leaderboard and alts themselves, I suppose. Seems to me the best way to do that is to simply uncap GPs. Keep the scoring system as is, but otherwise uncap them so the more active players are rewarded. I don't know that I like that system, but it really does seem the simplest solution. I would hate the game to become work. But if I'm being rewarded for doing the things I would do anyway, then I'll adjust.

I definetly understand your concerns about grinding, and I'm not a big fan of it myself. But it wouldn't hurt to try uncapping the points and see what happens. You've certainly allowed other way more disastrous changes to go live.

 

I think world boss attacks would be a sensible tie breaker for an active player competeition, being that it is straight across the board. Any sort of player you are, fighter, hunter, boss killer, energy.... we all hit the world boss as offen as possible.

Not that i think unlimited gamerpoints would EVER produce a tie... but on the chance of flipping a quarter and landing on the edge. I think that would be fair.

 

so heres my last bit about your faction contest, cuz it seems like kano is unwilling to give us a real contest, it might take away from the crafting development.

remove the time barrier for login and replace that as the parameter with number of world boss hits for the faction for the season. a much more fitting way to break the tie if two or more factions are tied for the top spots. Alt accounts/alt factions....never think of logging on to hit the world boss, they or someone logs in for the faction, does all the gps and calls it a day, never logging back in.

try it, i think yu will see a world of difference, cuz then real playing factions will be winning the ties, not who can login first.

there ive said my piece and im done with this, cuz if you wont try this, im not sure it matters then johnny is right remove it all together cuz right now its a farce, and everyone seems to recognize this except the people adminstrating the game.....

 

Thanks everyone for your feedback. To avoid any confusion with the game we will keep the original scoring system and rules. What we will change is the tiebreaker which is the requirement to finish points first. As stated previously:
"Additional points can be contributed to a Faction through levelling. Must be greater then level 150 to contribute. Lower level level-ups will give a lower GP reward compared to higher level level-ups (You can level up more frequently at the lower levels)" This will reward active Factions for their efforts through the entire season.

For attack actions on bosses battles etc, these cannot offer uncapped GPs as it would be too easy to game the system. Future actions such as boss kills, punch kills, challenge completes will be evaluated and possibly added as additional GP contribution sources.

We will keep you posted which season the changes will go live in and closely evaluate the outcome and feedback.